When I consider the motley collection of right wing, cowardly, blatantly xenophobic or out right racist nut jobs in the GOP who have been elected and re-elected, I think the need for Democrats trying to appeal to the blandest of the bland centrist candidates is an idea whose time is long dead.
It is a serious mistake to self-homogenize. It is also a mistake to pretend to be something you are not. Voters will accept a few outlying views if they perceive the candidate is real. For Democrats, the time is ripe for candidates who stand up proudly and advocate for the real needs of their voters, and also push back hard against the right wing rhetoric and grievance pushers. Show some spine, and let the chips fall.
", but you’ll recall that it’s been almost 10 years since Donald Trump first won the presidency. If the Democratic Party was subject to a “hostile takeover,” why didn’t it come from the all those anti-Trump, “country over party” conservatives? "
And over those 10 years centrist democrats have had every opportunity to become the opposition party...EVEN IF you don't 'like' Hong or the DSA or progressives, 10 years from now, seen in 20/20 hindsight, if we discovered that electing her (and her (and my) ilk)) was the wrong choice, ..It will STILL HAVE BEED THE RIGHT choice to make, SIMPLY BECAUSE it was different from doing the SAME GODDAMN THING that hasn't worked in 30 fucking years
That’s where I usually land as well. I have been voting for establishment Democrats since 1982, and the only place it has gotten us is in MAGA jail. And yet, the powers that be in the party continually try and force the same old slop down our throats, trying to convince us that this ilk is what will save the republic, when frankly it’s a big reason we are where we are today. Democratic voters are now the Republican voters of 2016, sick of being overlooked and taken for granted by the “elites”, while the old party fights desperately to beat it back. It will fail, just like it did on their side then. I only hope we make better choices than they did in our fury.
Simply put, they HAD their chance to make their case in a TIMELY manner and they failed to do so. Treat them the same way you would treat ANY employee who failed to do what they were HIRED for
I'm not a Wisconsin voter, so take anything I say with a grain of salt. I admit I am skeptical about Francesca Hong as a statewide candidate (it's one thing to walk back "defund the police", quite another to defend wanting to cancel Thanksgiving at one time because of colonialism). But at least she has some fire to her! Some clear desire to tackle issues straight on, and name names while doing so. I mean, no one wants a data center! Absolutely no one! Low hanging fruit, and yet one the "establishment preferred" candidate is afraid to touch, as if it were a live wire. Come on! Show some effing guts, people! GOP congressional candidates are overperforming their (very) unpopular leader, so holding onto/picking up seats is no given, especially considering the Democratic party overall is less popular than Trump right now. If Hong wins, it won't be because of her politics, it will be because she's not afraid of a street brawl. If "establishment Dems" want to keep the progressive tide at bay, it's long past time to show a little sense of the urgency the moment requires. Only time will tell.
I do think telling Americans the traditions they cherish are mired in colonialism and racism and should be abolished is not a winning electoral strategy.
Exactly...It was such an easy thing for her NOT to have done that...Kind of an amateur move.
I HATE discussions over 'electability' because its such a cynical centrist calculus to make, yet I can't help NOT doing it now.
Mamdani and AOC would never have made a gaffe like that, a gaffe frankly, that REALLY wouldn't be a gaffe in a country less stupid than current America is...Because its clear what Hong meant to convey, its just that you cant hand ammo to the people within the democratic coalition who are against you... (fuck what republicans think, if they can't dig up dirt on you they'll just make something up out of LITTEBOXES INCLASSROOMS whole cloth)
Watch how fast all the never trumpers go back to the gop once trump is gone. They will absolutely vote for a president Vance or Rubio.
When I consider the motley collection of right wing, cowardly, blatantly xenophobic or out right racist nut jobs in the GOP who have been elected and re-elected, I think the need for Democrats trying to appeal to the blandest of the bland centrist candidates is an idea whose time is long dead.
It is a serious mistake to self-homogenize. It is also a mistake to pretend to be something you are not. Voters will accept a few outlying views if they perceive the candidate is real. For Democrats, the time is ripe for candidates who stand up proudly and advocate for the real needs of their voters, and also push back hard against the right wing rhetoric and grievance pushers. Show some spine, and let the chips fall.
", but you’ll recall that it’s been almost 10 years since Donald Trump first won the presidency. If the Democratic Party was subject to a “hostile takeover,” why didn’t it come from the all those anti-Trump, “country over party” conservatives? "
And over those 10 years centrist democrats have had every opportunity to become the opposition party...EVEN IF you don't 'like' Hong or the DSA or progressives, 10 years from now, seen in 20/20 hindsight, if we discovered that electing her (and her (and my) ilk)) was the wrong choice, ..It will STILL HAVE BEED THE RIGHT choice to make, SIMPLY BECAUSE it was different from doing the SAME GODDAMN THING that hasn't worked in 30 fucking years
That’s where I usually land as well. I have been voting for establishment Democrats since 1982, and the only place it has gotten us is in MAGA jail. And yet, the powers that be in the party continually try and force the same old slop down our throats, trying to convince us that this ilk is what will save the republic, when frankly it’s a big reason we are where we are today. Democratic voters are now the Republican voters of 2016, sick of being overlooked and taken for granted by the “elites”, while the old party fights desperately to beat it back. It will fail, just like it did on their side then. I only hope we make better choices than they did in our fury.
Simply put, they HAD their chance to make their case in a TIMELY manner and they failed to do so. Treat them the same way you would treat ANY employee who failed to do what they were HIRED for
I'm not a Wisconsin voter, so take anything I say with a grain of salt. I admit I am skeptical about Francesca Hong as a statewide candidate (it's one thing to walk back "defund the police", quite another to defend wanting to cancel Thanksgiving at one time because of colonialism). But at least she has some fire to her! Some clear desire to tackle issues straight on, and name names while doing so. I mean, no one wants a data center! Absolutely no one! Low hanging fruit, and yet one the "establishment preferred" candidate is afraid to touch, as if it were a live wire. Come on! Show some effing guts, people! GOP congressional candidates are overperforming their (very) unpopular leader, so holding onto/picking up seats is no given, especially considering the Democratic party overall is less popular than Trump right now. If Hong wins, it won't be because of her politics, it will be because she's not afraid of a street brawl. If "establishment Dems" want to keep the progressive tide at bay, it's long past time to show a little sense of the urgency the moment requires. Only time will tell.
"I'm not a Wisconsin voter, so take anything I say with a grain of salt. I admit I am skeptical about Francesca Hong as a statewide candidate "
I am too, and I SO don't want to be...
This ball is for centrists to drop, and since that's ALL their fucking good at. Well...
I do think telling Americans the traditions they cherish are mired in colonialism and racism and should be abolished is not a winning electoral strategy.
Exactly...It was such an easy thing for her NOT to have done that...Kind of an amateur move.
I HATE discussions over 'electability' because its such a cynical centrist calculus to make, yet I can't help NOT doing it now.
Mamdani and AOC would never have made a gaffe like that, a gaffe frankly, that REALLY wouldn't be a gaffe in a country less stupid than current America is...Because its clear what Hong meant to convey, its just that you cant hand ammo to the people within the democratic coalition who are against you... (fuck what republicans think, if they can't dig up dirt on you they'll just make something up out of LITTEBOXES INCLASSROOMS whole cloth)