I think one of the side effects of one party always defining itself in terms of moderate centrism and the other a movement of religious zealotry is that you not only have the Overton window always being dragged to the right: your average American has little to no understanding what values and principles the Democratic Party holds dear.
This is the party that’s “supposed” to be the populist party of the working man. The only people making actual populist appeals from a left wing perspective: your Bernie’s, AOC’s, and now Mamdani’s are marginalized as much as possible the second they rise politically. For years the party has sought “almost Republicans” to run in marginal districts, and they typically do alright in wave elections. They’re also almost certainly the first to get cut when the political winds shift (see 06–10)
You see it reflected in the polling. Everyone who is struggling to some degree is voting republicans in overwhelming numbers and everyone doing alright is voting democrat. It’s far too simplistic to blame all of this on racism and sexism (Obama won an overwhelming majority promising a platform of significant change)
The Republican platform Is monstrous of course, and all of the demonizing minorities in the world won’t actually make a working class person’s life any better, however, unless Democrats start providing an actual alternative that people will believe in, there’s little reason to believe all of the above will change in any significant degree.
Yes to all of this!!! The GOP has been dreaming of destroying all of the social safety nets and most of the departments that protect American’s health and education for years! They are happy to be getting their wish to make not just poor people and minorities suffer, but all but anyone who is not obscenely wealthy.
There's reality on one hand, and there's 'that which is politically possible' on the other.
Reality:
The current state of our descent into a Fascistic, authoritarian dystopia is the direct and forseeable result of "good" Republican's (looking at you, Rick Wilson, et al) support for an insidious platform of national destruction that grew incrementally worse with each new iteration since the Eisehhower administration.
That which is politically possible:
Gain their political support in opposition to ~only~ the worst of the worst consequences of their own culpability, as long as you don't actually come out and say "this is your fucking fault, asshole."
The value of an opposition party can be diversity of ideas and tempering enthusiasm for quick change that may lead to unintended and negative consequences.
But only if that hypothetical party is, in fact, grounded in reality, evidence, facts, reason and operating in good faith.
The opposition party to the Democratic party exists within the Democratic party itself.
The Republican party is a reactionary one. It is faith based. And not even faith based on a justifiable interpretation of source material. It operates in bad faith to advance its agenda. It's agenda is conservative. Not conservative as in a slow resistance to inevitable change. It is conservative in that it actively seeks to conserve the worst aspects of the past: white supremacy, male supremacy, Christian nationalism, Imperialism, xenophobia, domestic tyranny through corrupt laws, courts, institutions, and the State's monopoly on violence, partiality for the wealthy, and a weakened ability of the people to respond in any way through the levers of politics.
Yes, to all of it. Democrats from the 1850s - today's "Republicans" - tried to implement the idea that the country worked best if a few wealthy people led it and doled out stuff. They wanted to keep slavery (I think many would happily go back to it) and started the Civil War. Same happened in the 1890s and 1920s (leading to the Great Depression). And in the 60s and 70s the wealthy started and succeeded in the plan to get where we are now - trillions moving upward, destroying rights of anyone except propertied whites, moving the Overton window rightward. Republicans have fought every bit of progress and have finally succeeded in taking over the country. Making millions unhealthy means little. RW media is strong and brainwashing with its disinformation. Thanks for saying it a lot more succinctly than me.
"Strong GOP" is always a rhetorical device due to Murc's Law. Because there are always consequences for what Democrats say. Nevertheless America punched them in the teeth so maybe what America wants IS a strong GOP to make sure that vulnerable minorities get the chop.
My question is, where are the Internet faves to swoop in and get in the barrel? Chuck Schumer had a health issue and that was the perfect moment for an Internet fave to say "See, Chuck Schumer is old and infirm, let's get rid of him and vote for me, as I am young and have new ideas. I am not the old ossified leadership!" Where are these faves? Schumer is basically out for the count. They could go for Hakeem Jeffries too and push him off a glass cliff so he'd never be Speaker.
Clearly what the Democratic Party is doing now isn't working. They should try moving to the left, and if it doesn't work then we can go back to what they were doing before. My thinking is that they are actually afraid that it will work and if it does then there will never be any going back to the center.I get the distinct feeling they are fearful of progressive success, not that it will lose elections.
Though I will say then that they should've stood ten deep and defended Biden like Bernie Sanders, AOC and the whole-assed CBC was begging them to do. Instead they followed Gavin Newsom and George Clooney.
So what that tells me is that Democrats actually don't care about leftism where it counts...the legislation, and only about being leftism rhetorically so they can feel good about themselves. Because as it stands if you push the bolt out and get great legislation out of a numerically shitty Congress, it means *nothing* because everyone will easily throw it away for manufactured bullshit.
Because Sanders, et al. were ignored on this critical point I am convinced at this point that they are only followed to give people a justification to hate the "establishment" of the Democratic Party. Yet it was the "establishment," the big money people, who threw all those advances away. And Republicans laugh all the way to absolute power as they destroy all of it.
I think one of the side effects of one party always defining itself in terms of moderate centrism and the other a movement of religious zealotry is that you not only have the Overton window always being dragged to the right: your average American has little to no understanding what values and principles the Democratic Party holds dear.
This is the party that’s “supposed” to be the populist party of the working man. The only people making actual populist appeals from a left wing perspective: your Bernie’s, AOC’s, and now Mamdani’s are marginalized as much as possible the second they rise politically. For years the party has sought “almost Republicans” to run in marginal districts, and they typically do alright in wave elections. They’re also almost certainly the first to get cut when the political winds shift (see 06–10)
You see it reflected in the polling. Everyone who is struggling to some degree is voting republicans in overwhelming numbers and everyone doing alright is voting democrat. It’s far too simplistic to blame all of this on racism and sexism (Obama won an overwhelming majority promising a platform of significant change)
The Republican platform Is monstrous of course, and all of the demonizing minorities in the world won’t actually make a working class person’s life any better, however, unless Democrats start providing an actual alternative that people will believe in, there’s little reason to believe all of the above will change in any significant degree.
Yes to all of this!!! The GOP has been dreaming of destroying all of the social safety nets and most of the departments that protect American’s health and education for years! They are happy to be getting their wish to make not just poor people and minorities suffer, but all but anyone who is not obscenely wealthy.
The party of Trump and Trumpism is not the party of Lincoln, it is the party of Booth.
I have voted for Republicans in the past because I have found some Democrats unsupportable. In some cases I have known the candidates personally.
At this point, if any Republican wants my support, they need to hop off the crazy train and denounce the hijacked GOP.
So true. The GOP has always been awful and counterproductive to everything decent.
There's reality on one hand, and there's 'that which is politically possible' on the other.
Reality:
The current state of our descent into a Fascistic, authoritarian dystopia is the direct and forseeable result of "good" Republican's (looking at you, Rick Wilson, et al) support for an insidious platform of national destruction that grew incrementally worse with each new iteration since the Eisehhower administration.
That which is politically possible:
Gain their political support in opposition to ~only~ the worst of the worst consequences of their own culpability, as long as you don't actually come out and say "this is your fucking fault, asshole."
The value of an opposition party can be diversity of ideas and tempering enthusiasm for quick change that may lead to unintended and negative consequences.
But only if that hypothetical party is, in fact, grounded in reality, evidence, facts, reason and operating in good faith.
The opposition party to the Democratic party exists within the Democratic party itself.
The Republican party is a reactionary one. It is faith based. And not even faith based on a justifiable interpretation of source material. It operates in bad faith to advance its agenda. It's agenda is conservative. Not conservative as in a slow resistance to inevitable change. It is conservative in that it actively seeks to conserve the worst aspects of the past: white supremacy, male supremacy, Christian nationalism, Imperialism, xenophobia, domestic tyranny through corrupt laws, courts, institutions, and the State's monopoly on violence, partiality for the wealthy, and a weakened ability of the people to respond in any way through the levers of politics.
Yes, to all of it. Democrats from the 1850s - today's "Republicans" - tried to implement the idea that the country worked best if a few wealthy people led it and doled out stuff. They wanted to keep slavery (I think many would happily go back to it) and started the Civil War. Same happened in the 1890s and 1920s (leading to the Great Depression). And in the 60s and 70s the wealthy started and succeeded in the plan to get where we are now - trillions moving upward, destroying rights of anyone except propertied whites, moving the Overton window rightward. Republicans have fought every bit of progress and have finally succeeded in taking over the country. Making millions unhealthy means little. RW media is strong and brainwashing with its disinformation. Thanks for saying it a lot more succinctly than me.
"Strong GOP" is always a rhetorical device due to Murc's Law. Because there are always consequences for what Democrats say. Nevertheless America punched them in the teeth so maybe what America wants IS a strong GOP to make sure that vulnerable minorities get the chop.
My question is, where are the Internet faves to swoop in and get in the barrel? Chuck Schumer had a health issue and that was the perfect moment for an Internet fave to say "See, Chuck Schumer is old and infirm, let's get rid of him and vote for me, as I am young and have new ideas. I am not the old ossified leadership!" Where are these faves? Schumer is basically out for the count. They could go for Hakeem Jeffries too and push him off a glass cliff so he'd never be Speaker.
Where are they?
Clearly what the Democratic Party is doing now isn't working. They should try moving to the left, and if it doesn't work then we can go back to what they were doing before. My thinking is that they are actually afraid that it will work and if it does then there will never be any going back to the center.I get the distinct feeling they are fearful of progressive success, not that it will lose elections.
Though I will say then that they should've stood ten deep and defended Biden like Bernie Sanders, AOC and the whole-assed CBC was begging them to do. Instead they followed Gavin Newsom and George Clooney.
So what that tells me is that Democrats actually don't care about leftism where it counts...the legislation, and only about being leftism rhetorically so they can feel good about themselves. Because as it stands if you push the bolt out and get great legislation out of a numerically shitty Congress, it means *nothing* because everyone will easily throw it away for manufactured bullshit.
Because Sanders, et al. were ignored on this critical point I am convinced at this point that they are only followed to give people a justification to hate the "establishment" of the Democratic Party. Yet it was the "establishment," the big money people, who threw all those advances away. And Republicans laugh all the way to absolute power as they destroy all of it.
Nailed it, Stephen!